Register    Login    Forum    Search    FAQ

Board index » Other topics » Controversial topics


Forum rules


Any controversial topic can be discussed. Freedom of expression is encouraged. The scientific validity of things posted in this forum may stray from reality quite wildly and the reader is advised to keep that in mind. Please refrain from bad language and DO NOT get overly abusive with other members. You MUST post in English. It is OK to have fiercely intense debate. This forum has no connection with CERN, the LHC or my site. The views here do not represent the forum's views or my views in any way. It is meant as a place to debate or discuss subjects that may create heated debate. Almost no moderation will occur in this forum at all.



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:30 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:20 pm
Posts: 4
Hi,

I am a non-believer in conspiracy theories nor anything like that, and I do have a minor degree in physics, which makes me a bit of a fan of the LHC, however, It does worry me though the "conincidence" of the Feb 2010 Chile Earthquake happenning just after LHC restart, and the same happenning Mar 2011 (right now!) with Japan after the (ater winter) LHC restart. We so not understand space-time, we only think we do. We are accelerating particles to the speed of light. We do not know a lot about it. How can we be sure these earthquakes are not just a coincidence ? I hope they. Any views on it?


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 8:39 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:32 am
Posts: 701
Location: XL - BXL - B
I don't believe that there is any reason to think that lhc has anything to do with it. Just like Chile, Japan is in a region where these things happen often, and every now and then it hits a high note.

Here is an interesting list of all the quakes of 2010:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthquakes_in_2010

Space-Time is a mathematical concept like Newtons gravity, there is nothing wrong with it. We know that mass applies a force on its environment/space we only don't how it does that.

On the other hand I think, yes the lhc is a risk because of the unnatural high concentration of collisions at a certain spot within our atmosphere, but this idea is already discussed in other topics. btw all the experts don't agree with me, because they say that there is no energy released during particle collisions, in contrast to a nuclear reaction, or in the case of mini black holes Hawking Radiation causes them to fade quickly, or Strangelets ... if you are worried here is a wiki page where you can get some extra info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_of_particle_collisions_at_the_Large_Hadron_Collider

_________________
Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your own living room.
Wear Sunscreen by Baz Luhrmann - Mary Schmich


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:34 am 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:20 pm
Posts: 4
Hi,
Thanks for the links. Interesting info.
in any case, you mentioned

Quote:
Chile, Japan is in a region where these things happen often, and every now and then it hits a high note


And yes, that is true, however both were the biggest recorded 8.8 and 8.9. And both aprox 1 week after restart. Yes, probably a coincidence ... but the probability of it not being a coincidence is not zero. And that still worries me (even after reading the links).

I wish I had as much faith in our physicists as you do. For example physicists do not know what Time is. They really dont. Another example 80% of the mass/energy of the universe (dark matter/dark energy) is missing. They dont have a clue where its gone. And the subatomic world (quantum) is even weirder. Entangled photons, they cant explain. They dont know. How can they be sure then that their "safety" equations apply in the world of light speed and N dimensions. I think they dont. They have the equivalent of a 1D vision on a 3D world (or is it 4D?). Not enough. By definition if they knew then we would not need an LHC at all.
What if ... what if they are wrong ... I hope they are right!...


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 3:42 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:22 am
Posts: 1461
Location: Berwick-Upon-Tweed (UK)
Welcome to our happy place beltrichard :)

What made you try and connect the LHC with earthquakes?

I have seen another person say this on a forum I am a member of, although they said its probably because the LHC created a black hole and it is now in the middle of the earth :lol: well thats not very right because the LHC didn't create any black holes last year ;)

Charms :thumbup:

_________________
Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted with large ones either by Albert Einstein.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 10:06 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:32 am
Posts: 701
Location: XL - BXL - B
CharmQuark wrote:
What made you try and connect the LHC with earthquakes?

You should read what people say:
beltrichard wrote:
... both were the biggest recorded 8.8 and 8.9. And both aprox 1 week after restart. Yes, probably a coincidence ... but the probability of it not being a coincidence is not zero.


I guess next year's restart in 2012 ... might be third time's the charm :)

_________________
Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your own living room.
Wear Sunscreen by Baz Luhrmann - Mary Schmich


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 10:16 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:32 am
Posts: 701
Location: XL - BXL - B
beltrichard wrote:
I wish I had as much faith in our physicists as you do.

haha

_________________
Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your own living room.
Wear Sunscreen by Baz Luhrmann - Mary Schmich


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 7:20 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:22 am
Posts: 1461
Location: Berwick-Upon-Tweed (UK)
Chelle :) I do read what people put, but come on people are connecting everything with this earthquake, armageddon, the LHC, what about plain old Mother Nature? people need to think about this stuff they really do ;) oh and if the wolrd does go kaboomnext year of course it will be the LHCs fault ;)

_________________
Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted with large ones either by Albert Einstein.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 8:50 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:32 am
Posts: 701
Location: XL - BXL - B
CharmQuark wrote:
Chelle :) I do read what people put, but come on people are connecting everything with this earthquake, armageddon, the LHC, what about plain old Mother Nature? people need to think about this stuff they really do ;) oh and if the wolrd does go kaboomnext year of course it will be the LHCs fault ;)

I agree that its very unlikely that lhc activity is related to this, 'beltrichard' could perhaps search after some data and see how much the quakes and the activity of the lhc correlates, that should give a clear insight. And if its one on one perhaps Japan could file a financial claim for damages to cern.

_________________
Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your own living room.
Wear Sunscreen by Baz Luhrmann - Mary Schmich


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 10:40 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:20 pm
Posts: 4
Hi,
CharmQuark wrote:
what about plain old Mother Nature?

yes, I do think about plain old Mother Nature as well, I just dont do binary reasoning, my reasoning is more probabilistic. That is, the fact that Mother Earth is the most probable cause to me means that it is the *most* probable cause, which in turn means that there is a non-zero probability of the cause being something else and therefore worth looking into just in case.

Chelle wrote:
'beltrichard' could perhaps search after some data and see how much the quakes and the activity of the lhc correlates.

I could try but it is way too difficult (impossible?) to do proper stats with such a small amount of data, just a one and a bit LHC years (not 100 years), and the effects (if any) are not going to show as easy as push the button building moves, unpress the button building stops moving... if there is a correlation (im not saying there is) it would show in the stats way more subtle than that...but that gets lost if there is not enough data.

I will start looking anyway ...


Last edited by beltrichard on Mon Mar 14, 2011 11:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Mon Mar 14, 2011 11:14 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:20 pm
Posts: 4
CharmQuark wrote:
Welcome to our happy place beltrichard

Thanks! :)

CharmQuark wrote:
What made you try and connect the LHC with earthquakes?

TV news. I dont watch TV often but heard on it about LHC restart one day then a few days later same channel was showing Japan live. The "maybe" clicked in.

CharmQuark wrote:
I have seen another person say this on a forum I am a member of, although they said its probably because the LHC created a black hole and it is now in the middle of the earth :lol:

I agree that does sound quite silly ...
If ever there is proof of a correlation between LHC and earthquakes (not saying there is) then I doubt very much that anyone could ever find out the reason for it ... specially as LHC would then be shut down and with it any hope of finding out. Could you imagine turning it on just to investigate the reason for turning it off :)


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Tue Mar 15, 2011 3:28 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:32 am
Posts: 701
Location: XL - BXL - B
beltrichard wrote:
Chelle wrote:
'beltrichard' could perhaps search after some data and see how much the quakes and the activity of the lhc correlates.

I could try but it is way too difficult (impossible?) to do proper stats with such a small amount of data, just a one and a bit LHC years (not 100 years), and the effects (if any) are not going to show as easy as push the button building moves, unpress the button building stops moving... if there is a correlation (im not saying there is) it would show in the stats way more subtle than that...but that gets lost if there is not enough data.

I will start looking anyway ...

Come to think of it, recently there was also a major solar flare / plasma emission from the sun. It might have a slightly more serious impact than the lhc ... I dont see any action - reaction with earth quakes.

_________________
Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your own living room.
Wear Sunscreen by Baz Luhrmann - Mary Schmich


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 12:44 am 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:22 am
Posts: 1461
Location: Berwick-Upon-Tweed (UK)
beltrichard wrote:

Thanks! :)

TV news. I dont watch TV often but heard on it about LHC restart one day then a few days later same channel was showing Japan live. The "maybe" clicked in.

I agree that does sound quite silly ...
If ever there is proof of a correlation between LHC and earthquakes (not saying there is) then I doubt very much that anyone could ever find out the reason for it ... specially as LHC would then be shut down and with it any hope of finding out. Could you imagine turning it on just to investigate the reason for turning it off :)


beltrichard :D

You are very welcome :thumbup:

Charms :D

I can see how your mind would try and click things, I was there myself last year when we had them 3 big earthquakes sometimes you just can't help it thing is I go into freakout mode which is bad :oops:

LOL well it would make things interesting I guess sadly the poor LHC has had everything thrown at it ;) but yet it still keeps on going just doing its thing :whistle: I don't think people will ever stop connecting things with the LHC it could be a good thing over all I guess means people are still watching and are interested ;)

_________________
Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted with large ones either by Albert Einstein.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:01 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:27 pm
Posts: 4
I, too, was wondering if maybe the converse is true. Are things at the LHC shifting our world to the point of an earthquake in Haiti, tsunami in Australia and now earthquakes in Japan? I was trying to look at the dates and match them to what is happening at CERN.

_________________
Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine.
Sir Arthur Eddington


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post Posted: Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:32 pm 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 2:22 am
Posts: 1461
Location: Berwick-Upon-Tweed (UK)
Hi nonvertical moun :)

moved your post here as I agree with Chelle that it is more suited in this conversation :thumbup:

Charms :D

_________________
Anyone who doesn't take truth seriously in small matters cannot be trusted with large ones either by Albert Einstein.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Earthquakes
 Post Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 8:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:27 pm
Posts: 4
No worries. Thanks for putting it in the right spot. Just like at home, I sometimes leave things where they don't belong. ;)

Meanwhile, I got my start studying Newtonian Physics and I have been researching antipodes in relation to all these disasters. Chile and Japan are antipodes and they both registered earthquakes of 8.8 and 8.9 respectively just over a year apart. Then Haiti and Australia are antipodes and they both had quakes of 7.0 and 6.3 about a year apart. I'm doing more investigating.

_________________
Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine.
Sir Arthur Eddington


Top 
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Board index » Other topics » Controversial topics


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

 
 

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron